A simple L2 security and finalization roadmap

[TimDaub]

@vbuterin

If the concern is that L2s are not paying enough gas, then we should fix that by setting a minimum blob gasprice. That way L1 can get paid and at the same time L2s get certainty that a sufficient level of capacity exists to handle their needs, even if their application sees an unexpectedly high level of success.

You say EIP 7762 addresses both that

1. L2s will pay their fair share for using Ethereum; and that
2. L1 will get paid?

This is an extra ordinary claim that is very hard to evaluate as someone who’s not an Ethereum researcher. I do see the Dune charts in EIP 7762 and they look promising. But as an Ethereum investor, I’m anchored to the expectation that Ethereum’s fee accrual is roughly 100x less of what its market cap is. So if in 2024 2B USD in fees were accrued to ETH investors then a 200B USD market cap seems fair. As an Ethereum investor, I’m also anchored to the idea that there’s a mechanical connection between the protocol’s ability to accrue fees and its market cap and that arbitrage will keep these connected.

• EIP 7762 discussions focus on the 1 wei blobgas minimum parameter having been set wrongly and needing too many blocks to scale up blob price => not a fundamental proof that this will get the L1 paid, it lacks a projection calculation IMO. EIP 7762 discussions don’t center around “getting the L1 paid” IMO.
• The EIP 7762 charts, which show that more blobs will be priced with the minimum blob gasprice are encouraging but they don’t project that we’ll earn 10x more either.

@vbuterin

at the same time L2s get certainty that a sufficient level of capacity exists to handle their needs, even if their application sees an unexpectedly high level of success.

I personally have zero doubts about you and others’ ability to scale Ethereum. I frankly don’t understand the L2s’ logic here. Why do we as Ethereum have to prove to them that we can scale? Do they know something about Ethereum scaling that others don’t? E.g. that there’ll be difficulties down the road? A tangential question is: Where else could they go for the same level of security if they had unexpected high levels of success but Ethereum doesn’t scale?

Personally, I’m actually more worried about the short to mid term pain of having to hold Ether while we capture DA market share. My understanding is that the L2+DA breakthrough is deflationary to the price of transacting on secure blockchains like Ethereum and that my anchoring in past fee accrual statistics has become unreasonable since EIP 4844 shipped. Still, I don’t think we can argue away that there are many in my painful position who have been locked into ETH price at around 2000 USD. How do we motivate to them that despite their bad entry price we have to keep capture DA market share instead of focusing on fee accrual?

Frankly most of my concerns center around Ethereum pricing blobs with a mechanism that triggers only on congestion, and at the same time the Ethereum researchers are constantly working to improve congestion with technical breakthroughs. Perspective wise this doesn’t inspire optimism for more fee accrual in the future. Maybe then we must not price blobs through a congestion mechanism anymore, but differently?